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Burning of leaves, or Why'd we bother with banning smoking in private businesses?

I don't smoke. I am completely and totally againsy yje law that tells a guy that he cannot allow smoking in his restaurant or store. Since I'm a reasonbly sentient adult, i am perfectly willing to and capable of making a decision about entering an establishment that would allow smoking. I am aware of a lot very smug, self-righteous sacks who disagree with my point of view. They are wrong, but that's okay. It really doesn't affect me. By now, some of you might be wondering about the thread title here..........

 

How many of those sel-same anti-smoking zealots are perfectly willing to go out into their yard and ruin the day and the health of 4000 people downwind of their yard? Any nimrod with a pile of leaves and a lighter can go foul the air and make innumerable people sick. These are people who are minding their own business, working outdoors, playing outdoors, enjoying the outdoors...

It even affects people who are indoors. Doesn't seem to be a concern for anybody here in Benton.

Doing a bit of research will reveal that the smoke from burning oak leaves is seriously bad for your health. There is more data on the toxicity of the oak leaves than there is on the ill-effects of second-hand smoke, and yet, here I am watching another smudge-pot smoldering and making people sick.

 

It is time for our city leaders to take up the mantle and lead.

A town of 30,000 people should not allow burning of trash.

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Nothing?
No one else has a problem with this activity?
I agree on the banning of smoking in restaurants. I think it is going too far. A thoughtful restaurant owner should section off the smoking area but he should have the option. Some people are really sickened by second hand smoke. For those of us non-smokers I really hate to go home with clothes that smell like an ashtray. As far as trash and leave burning...amen brother. Im a leaf burner but I don't do it right next to the road. I lburn on the back of my property and aim for a calm day when there is little wind so the smoke goes up. Anyway, you can't please everybody.
Let the restaurant owner decide on his own. He shouldn't be required to provide for nonsmokers.
The market will determine his needs.

The calm day of leaf burning is more egregious than the windy day. The smoke goes up 20 feet and just lingers.
It looks like a cloud over the city right now. Saturday, sans rain, is gonna be a really bad day around here.
I sometimes smoke but do not like it in any buildings, clubs, etc. Smokers should go out on a patio or something.

We rarely burn leaves, but it's not that many and in the back of the yard so it doesn't sit and smolder for days. We then have others that will burn trash and you can smell it for days INSIDE your house.
dan berry said something that could change my views on leaf burning:

"Doing a bit of research will reveal that the smoke from burning oak leaves is seriously bad for your health. There is more data on the toxicity of the oak leaves than there is on the ill-effects of second-hand smoke, ..."

So I did a little google search on the matter and didn't find anything on oak leaves as a serious hazard to health. I'm now asking dan to make good on his statement with links to where I can find the info he says exists.
What's the matter, Dan? Are you tired of Big Brother making decisions for you or are you clamoring for his help?

I'm a little confused. You state that business owners should have the freedom to allow a totally legal activity within their establishments and that the government is too blame for the intrusion upon that freedom, but then you state that city leaders should lead the way in the taking of other people's freedom to burn rubbish.

I don't like it when my neighbor burns his leaves either. But the leaves are his, the property is his and we have to share the atmosphere. If we should ban leaf burning, which pollutes the air, then we should ban farting in elevators, fossil fuel powered machines, chicken houses, pigs should be genetically altered so they don't waller in their own urine, coal should never be mined again, paper mills should be banned, road kill should be removed within an hour of death, skunks should be totally exterminated, bar-b-que joints should be closed, every other fume spilling restaurant should be required to filter all the air in and around their establishments, all those with extreme body odor should have access to public bathing facilities, timber companies should be banned from burning cutovers, farmers should be banned from burning wheat and rice fields...the list can go on and on.

Hasn't the last 2 years of enacted Federal law taught you anything about the loss of freedoms? Big Brother will gladly take the freedoms you don't want anymore. Government does not grant any freedoms they only take them away, especially if you ask them to.


Junior Samples said:
What's the matter, Dan? Are you tired of Big Brother making decisions for you or are you clamoring for his help?

I'm a little confused. You state that business owners should have the freedom to allow a totally legal activity within their establishments and that the government is too blame for the intrusion upon that freedom, but then you state that city leaders should lead the way in the taking of other people's freedom to burn rubbish.

I don't like it when my neighbor burns his leaves either. But the leaves are his, the property is his and we have to share the atmosphere. If we should ban leaf burning, which pollutes the air, then we should ban farting in elevators, fossil fuel powered machines, chicken houses, pigs should be genetically altered so they don't waller in their own urine, coal should never be mined again, paper mills should be banned, road kill should be removed within an hour of death, skunks should be totally exterminated, bar-b-que joints should be closed, every other fume spilling restaurant should be required to filter all the air in and around their establishments, all those with extreme body odor should have access to public bathing facilities, timber companies should be banned from burning cutovers, farmers should be banned from burning wheat and rice fields...the list can go on and on.

Hasn't the last 2 years of enacted Federal law taught you anything about the loss of freedoms? Big Brother will gladly take the freedoms you don't want anymore. Government does not grant any freedoms they only take them away, especially if you ask them to.

No, you totally miss the point.
If the store allows smoking, I can decide to enter or patronize another business.

When you burn that pile of leaves and it permeates my yard and house, I no longer hae the choice of whether Iwant to put up with it.The Gummint is there to protect me from other people's stupidity, Not my own.
You do not have the freedom to ruin to my life, only your own.
That is the point.
A civilized town shouldn't allow this behavior. It's a health and public safety issue. The argument that 'I only have a small pile' isn't valid either. It still makes people sick. Ten little piles equals one big pile anyway.

Is that clear enough, Junior?
I was curious about this topic as well, and found some info to share--

This link elaborates on the health hazards of leaf burning in general: http://www.epa.gov/ttnatw01/burn/leafburn2.html






Harper said:
dan berry said something that could change my views on leaf burning:

"Doing a bit of research will reveal that the smoke from burning oak leaves is seriously bad for your health. There is more data on the toxicity of the oak leaves than there is on the ill-effects of second-hand smoke, ..."

So I did a little google search on the matter and didn't find anything on oak leaves as a serious hazard to health. I'm now asking dan to make good on his statement with links to where I can find the info he says exists.
Dan wrote: "No, you totally miss the point.
If the store allows smoking, I can decide to enter or patronize another business.

When you burn that pile of leaves and it permeates my yard and house, I no longer hae the choice of whether Iwant to put up with it.The Gummint is there to protect me from other people's stupidity, Not my own.
You do not have the freedom to ruin to my life, only your own.
That is the point.
A civilized town shouldn't allow this behavior. It's a health and public safety issue. The argument that 'I only have a small pile' isn't valid either. It still makes people sick. Ten little piles equals one big pile anyway.

Is that clear enough, Junior?"
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Dan,

I didn't miss your point. As a matter of fact, I fully understand your point.
I think maybe you have missed my point.

The government still allows humans to use fire for good purposes. If you let the government take that right away from others, you will be willing to allow the government to take more rights away in the future.

You can't legislate common sense. If you want to give up the right to use fire in a safe manner, start your own POA or move to a neighborhood that has a POA which disallows the burning of rubbish. Otherwise, you are forcing your will upon the rest of the population which may want to retain the right to use fire.

"If the store allows smoking, I can decide to enter or patronize another business."
If the government allows leaf burning, you can decide to wear a gas mask.

How do you think the folks in Pine Bluff feel about stinky air? The Federal, State, County and Local governments allow the emmision of sulferous gasses. Under your line of thinking, paper products would be non-existant. Pine Bluffians have a choice too. They can move to the South side of the paper mill or move to a different location.

I'm not trying to be rude to you, Dan. I just don't understand why the majority of a population should lose a right because a minority of a popoulation has a gripe.


Munky said:
It would be really neat if there were a way to start a local community compost pile.
Here are some references on the subject:
http://www.arhomeandgarden.org/composting.htm
http://www.arhomeandgarden.org/composting/build_a_pile.htm
http://www.americancomposting.com/acindex/recycle.htm

So, Dan, if the smell gets really bad, you might consider starting a compost pile and asking your neighbors to contribute their leaves rather than burning their leaves. Once they figure out what a good deal composting is, they might want to have their own compost pile.


Junior Samples said:
Dan wrote: "No, you totally miss the point.
If the store allows smoking, I can decide to enter or patronize another business.

When you burn that pile of leaves and it permeates my yard and house, I no longer hae the choice of whether Iwant to put up with it.The Gummint is there to protect me from other people's stupidity, Not my own.
You do not have the freedom to ruin to my life, only your own.
That is the point.
A civilized town shouldn't allow this behavior. It's a health and public safety issue. The argument that 'I only have a small pile' isn't valid either. It still makes people sick. Ten little piles equals one big pile anyway.

Is that clear enough, Junior?"
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Dan,

I didn't miss your point. As a matter of fact, I fully understand your point.
I think maybe you have missed my point.

The government still allows humans to use fire for good purposes. If you let the government take that right away from others, you will be willing to allow the government to take more rights away in the future.

You can't legislate common sense. If you want to give up the right to use fire in a safe manner, start your own POA or move to a neighborhood that has a POA which disallows the burning of rubbish. Otherwise, you are forcing your will upon the rest of the population which may want to retain the right to use fire.

"If the store allows smoking, I can decide to enter or patronize another business."
If the government allows leaf burning, you can decide to wear a gas mask.

How do you think the folks in Pine Bluff feel about stinky air? The Federal, State, County and Local governments allow the emmision of sulferous gasses. Under your line of thinking, paper products would be non-existant. Pine Bluffians have a choice too. They can move to the South side of the paper mill or move to a different location.

I'm not trying to be rude to you, Dan. I just don't understand why the majority of a population should lose a right because a minority of a popoulation has a gripe.

You still don't understand?
Then there is no point in continuing with you.
Dan wrote: "You still don't understand?
Then there is no point in continuing with you."

Oh. I understand. I understand better and better every time you post.

This is about you. This is totally about you. You want more folks to be like you. And you want the world to turn on your every whim. I am sorry that you may have respiritory troubles. I do too. Leaf smoke is quite irritating. Yet, unlike you, I respect other's rights to freedom as prescribed by our founders.
It is interesting that you would support tax payer funds being spent on enhanced fire police. You want a "Leaf Police"? Really?
What's next? A "saggin" police or a bad breath police?

Learning to play with others used to be a graded behavior in school when I came up.

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